Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Discussions about the Ryde "Set-top Box" Style Digital ATV Receiver. See https://wiki.batc.org.uk/Ryde_Receiver
MW0RUD
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Joined: Fri Apr 24, 2020 3:09 pm

Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by MW0RUD » Wed Nov 10, 2021 2:48 pm

Hi Mike,

That is supposed to be working and it works in my test setup, so possibly a software bug somewhere.

Can you explain your setup, test procedure and what does and does not work in a little more detail so we can try and reproduce it?

Tim

G0LJF
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by G0LJF » Wed Nov 10, 2021 3:41 pm

Hi Tim,

No problem. Ryde is latest v 202111051 (as in new). P2020 Buster is 202108230.
NB: You must do a full power reset when you swap receiver boards (and USB) as I have noticed that the D1 Rx_Valid LED stays on after a successful DVBS2 signal reception (and you then manually STOP Receiver in the SSH menu).

I have a Knucker V2 board that I just built, combined with a Ryde I just built. The Ryde is a 2GB RPi 4. Has 64 GBy Ultra flash card. I use the LOWER F plug on Knucker.

I connected the RPi 4 / Ryde to a fully populated "v1" expansion board and thence onto a G0MJW break out Button board.

I use a TSOP4138 IR sensor from CPC (leads need to be swapped, be careful) on 3.3V directly.

I power the lot with a RPi 3 official PSU (its 2.5 A I think).
I ALWAYS used (all cases) a external -30dB Attenuator (play it safe) and I set the P2020 PE43702 internal Attenuator to - 20dB (play it more safely).

I generate DVB-T with my (full system) P2020 on 71 MHz but the Ryde does not seem to tune that low (?) so I have gone to the 146.5 MHz P2020 output band instead at 333 Ss. I did use my scope at this point to verify the TS_Valid NAND TS_Clock signal was a square wave on FTDI from UC3 Pin 8.
I received a DVB-T picture with Ryde. No D1 Rx_Valid LED illumination.

I THEN generated a DVBS2 / 333 Ss signal for use with MT. Still on 146.5 MHz.
I unplugged the Knucker and tried my Minitioune Pro V2 instead with the DVBS2 signal. Full power reset.


With this the D1 LED does work, a bit unreliably.

HOWEVER I just noticed that the default F socket for a MT is LOWER in the Ryde presets! MT always uses the UPPER one - so my error there in not spotting the presets are all on LOWER F. I just noticed and that gave me an intermittent lock (but LED D1 flashed nonetheless).

Is that enough information?

I can repeat for you to make sure.... It may well be me....

Just did it ALL again on 146.5 / 333 K Ss. No Ryde D1 Rx_Valid LED with my Knucker board and DVB-T. D1 Rx_Valid LED worked fine with DVBS2 and MT Pro V2.

Note: Full power reset after receiver boards are swapped.

My new Knucker board may be faulty, of course. Scope next... Just to be sure....

Yes, with DVB-T signal from P2020 I get a 32us period pulse train on Knucker U3C Pin8. That's 31.250 KHz. Pulse disappears with P2020 OFF.

All confirmed my end.

Mike

G8GKQ
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by G8GKQ » Wed Nov 10, 2021 8:38 pm

Mike

I think that you may be over-thinking this.

You can run Ryde with both the Knucker and MiniTiouner connected to the RPi by USB at the same time. No need to swap them out.

Also, no need to use the ssh console menu for DVB-T. You can do it all using the remote control. Sorry, the Wiki is out of date; I'll put it on my long list of things to do (unless anyone else would like to do it).

The lock light works exactly as expected for DVB-S2 and DVB-T on both my Ryde receivers.

Dave, G8GKQ

Edit - The Knucker/Ryde combination does work at 71 MHz. Just tested.

G0LJF
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by G0LJF » Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:15 pm

Hi Dave,

Thanks for the advice. I did not know that BOTH MT Pro and Knucker may be connected simultaneously.

Nor did I know that use of the SSH menu was no longer mandatory for Knucker [with DVB-T]. I did see an OSD Band option called "146T". Is this selection needed?

Nonetheless I will repeat my test again with both MT and Knucker connected. Just to be sure for the third time here.

OK, I HAVE IT (TS_Valid LED that is) WORKING at 146.5 MHz!

It is, perhaps, my exclusive use of the Knucker SSH menu that is maybe causing the non LED function, somehow.

If I now only use the OSD menu and select Band 146T it works! Even the D1 TS_Valid LED works.

Could my use of ONLY the old SSH menu have made me be in error? It appears so. Somehow. I may have been omitting the Band "146T" selection?
But I did get a valid picture? Still a bit puzzled.

LED TS_Valid is working, at last. Bear in mind all I did tonight was to power everything back on (connect both MT and Knucker) and try again with OSD.

And I can enter a DVB-T frequency of 71 MHz.

Thank you again, Mike

G0LJF
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by G0LJF » Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:29 am

Hello All,

Yes its the SSH Ryde v 202111051 (with Knucker board) menu item 11 operation that is 'faulty' (with the expansion button board "Rx_Valid" LED").

This confirms it:

a) Connect only Knucker to Ryde. P2020 supplies 146.5 MHz DVB-T at 333 KHz. Or S/s. Use an HDMI monitor on your RPi.
b) Power the Ryde, then do a factory reset (from the SSH menu). Just to be sure of a 'new' Ryde.
c) Power Ryde/Knucker off-on-again to be sure!
d) Select the "DVB-T RX Menu-driven DVB-T RX using Knucker Tuner" menu 11 on SSH (type "menu" at SSH prompt).
e) Select "Frequency Set the Receive Frequency" as 146500 kHz then select "Bandwidth Set the Receive Bandwidth" as 333 kHz.
f) Select "Receive Start the DVB-T Receiver". Look at your HDMI monitor. And WAIT about 30s for tuner initialisation.
g) P2020 turned on, Tx enabled, the DVB-T signal from P2020 is now correctly shown, decoded, on the HDMI monitor.
h) NO D1 "Rx_Valid" LED operation at all.

So don't use the SSH menu with Knucker is my advice; use the OSD ones, or be aware of this limitation.

IF you have a brand new Knucker its not possible to test the operation of this LED using the SSH menu. USE THE OSD only.

73, Mike

G8GKQ
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by G8GKQ » Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:54 am

OK Mike

That explains it. The ssh-controlled DVB-T receive functionality was always meant to be an interim solution until Tim was able to develop the full Ryde solution.

The lock light was never intended to be implemented (and certainly not documented as a feature) in the interim solution.

Dave

G0LJF
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by G0LJF » Thu Nov 11, 2021 12:59 pm

No problems, Dave,

Its only a problem for brand new Knucker board builds where the user cannot fully test the board.

Just as long as we all now know (for this Ryde release) - for a new board, the Knucker SSH menu cannot be used for D1 Rx_Valid LED testing.

It made me suspect that my NEW board was defective. Or that I had made a mistake (more likely). You see the problem? How does one know.

Thanks again,

Mike

g7ntg
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by g7ntg » Thu Nov 11, 2021 4:50 pm

Dave - in your post of Nov 10th you say there is no need to use the ssh menu for DVB-T - Did you mean DVB-S?
I can only control my Knucker with ssh using PuTty
Jim

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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by G8GKQ » Thu Nov 11, 2021 5:01 pm

Hi Jim

I announced remote control for the Knucker (DVB-T) just after CAT 21 online viewtopic.php?f=130&t=7649#p28996.

If you make sure that you have the latest software, you should find that there are 2 extra channels 437T and 146T, Once you have selected these channels, you can set DVB-T frequency and bandwidth (default is 333). Unfortunately, on some screens, these channels are off-screen. The list has grown too long!

73

dave

g7ntg
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Re: Progress Knucker -> Ryde?

Post by g7ntg » Thu Nov 11, 2021 6:43 pm

OK thanks Dave - that works fine now - is there any way I can remove some of the unwanted presets so that they will appear on screen? I am building this one for Nigel 2E0EHH so it will only be used for DVB-T
Jim

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