Raspberry Pi 5 - Portsdown 5?

[G8GKQ]

Hi

The release of the Raspberry Pi 5 has been announced today https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/introd ... berry-pi-5. It seems to be a mixed bag from the DATV perspective. The main issue being that it does not seem to have any hardware video encoding. I will pre-purchase one and see what it can do.

In advance of that, I would like to hear your views on what the Portsdown 5 should be. I am keen to significantly improve on the Portsdown 4, and was thinking of a higher definition (1920x1080) HDMI touchscreen display and a touchscreen-based system running a full Raspberry Pi desktop, to allow for multiple windows. Something that might allow, for example, BandViewer, Video Receiver and TX control all to be visible at the same time.

Portsdown 4 will still be actively developed and supported for at least a couple of years as the preferred ATV portable and beginners' system.

The time is approaching for Portsdown 2020 (based on the Raspberry Pi 3) to be frozen. I have a few bugfixes in the pipeline for it, but will move towards freezing an SD Card image that can be downloaded and used in the Portsdown 2020 hardware forever. This image will not receive capability or security updates, but will retain all the existing Portsdown 2020 capabilities for as long as your hardware survives.

Please reply below with what hardware (touchscreen? keyboard?) you would like to see used in the Portsdown 5, and what new or existing features should be developed. I am keen that it should not just be a faster Portsdown 4.

Dave, G8GKQ

[G1BVI]

Hi Dave
Having built a Portsdown 2020 with a 3.5 inch screen and then upgrading to a Portsdown 4 with a 7 inch touch screen I think it would be very useful if the Rpi 5 could as a basic system just replace the Rpi 4 in a Portsdown 4 with whatever functionality goes with it.

This would make it easy for many uses to upgrade their Portsdown 4 systems with minimun extra outlay.

Can it get any better !!

A Rpi 5 8GB is £79 plus a fan plus a 5Amp 5V PSU so power consumption / heat is obviously on the increase too.

Looking forward to whatever is produced

73

Nick

[g0mjw]

Hi

The release of the Raspberry Pi 5 has been announced today https://www.raspberrypi.com/news/introd ... berry-pi-5. It seems to be a mixed bag from the DATV perspective. The main issue being that it does not seem to have any hardware video encoding. I will pre-purchase one and see what it can do.
Dave, G8GKQ

I noticed it has H265 decoding (only), but did not mention encoding. With a 2.4 GHz CPU it might make a decent stab at software H264.

"it only takes around 1 processor to encode 1080p60 with our default settings (which is still better quality than the PI 4 hardware encoder)."

What to make it better? I think we need to get away from the limitations of using the touch screen for video by removing it from the control function. Yes, seriously, but replacing control with a smaller lower cost LCD touchscreen. The display can then use the HDMI ports so you can have a small portable system or a large desktop, whatever resolution you like up to 2x4k, displaying multiple windows perhaps if the CPU is up to it. The smaller screen then does things like context sensitive buttons just like we have now, video previews etc. without having to hide the controls when showing the video.

I would also integrate a lot of the DB25 / test functionality onto a single PCB, just to make life easier. We could then standardize on IO expansion, power supply, perhaps have an ADC for monitoring stuff or power detection, PTT switching, buffered control signals.

Mike

[radiogareth]

You beat me to it Dave,.....tricky question...
The touch screen on the PD4 is such a handy interface so ANY solution must use a touch screen, costly in big sizes but they may become more affordable in the future. Its wasn't long ago that H264 was great, H265 nice but not a deal-breaker (IMHO). If the RPI5 doesn't not have an easy route to encoding H265 with an on-board chip or CHEAP outboard dongle, it seems not worth progressing.

I think the wider issue is possibly the convergence of technologies in as much as a good laptop (Surface Pro 4/5 and beyond) and DATV Easy will generate pretty much any sort of video and will also run all the other multitudinous 'radio' related programmes we might wish. Opentuner with some changes to suit the remarkable ease of use that PD4/Long Mynd offers, especially in a portable environment would render a similar RPi based solution a 'duplicate' without the easy access to the majority of windows based stuff.

Increased current consumption detracts from portable operations although the increasingly affordable LiFePO4 batteries negate that (if you have the cash ...) but your are approaching the consumption of a reasonable modern laptop......
I'd quote a favorite of mine...."Tis in vain to do with more, that which can be done with less".....

And lets not forget the Langstone....

Gareth

[g8lce]

I have been using a Yolobox Pro for DATV and it has some nice features but also some bits that could be improved upon for DATV. It is difficult to explain the way it works without physically using it. It will only stream so needs a networked Pluto and will only do 1000SR, 2000SR and up. It needs an Internet link to program any new RTMP stream outputs. However it is touchscreen and you can mix 4 HDMI inputs and a webcam. It works on it's internal battery for 3 hours and charges/runs from a USB-C. It has caption overlays and image/testcard storage. It is not a Portsdown replacement but a very handy tool for generating program material or DATV input. Some of the ways it does things would be good for 'Portsdown 5' and somethings could be improved for DATV.
Another input for DATV is a Blackmagic ATEM mini. Both these devices have a 'webcam' output so can be used as an input device for a 'Portsdown 5'. The basic Blackmagic ATEM mini's without streaming are getting cheaper secondhand. You need the Blackmagic ATEM mini pro for a streaming version but you need a laptop to setup a stream. The 'Portsdown 5' could control the Blackmagic ATEM however and probably be controlled by it.
Just to throw in another two device's for input/control of a 'Portsdown 5' there is the Loupedeck CT and the Stream Deck Plus. These can be programmed to display various things and have knobs on!
All very nice but I'm not doing the programming!!!!
One thing that would be nice to have and may be useful in the future is a web browser and a way of overlaying a web page over the video. Web based graphic overlays seem to be catching on and the Internet seems to be something that is part of life. Here in Cornwall the GB3NQ stream is used by many for monitoring the repeater while getting into the repeater can also be done via the Internet. This keeps the interest in DATV and hopefully does not stop the experimenting TX and RX projects.

Martin G8LCE

[radiogareth]

Having thought about 'what next' I think the DATV communities next main issue is going to become 'decoding' the DATV that we now have many ways of producing....either software or hardware (another NIM??). Sometimes progress isn't useful....
Gareth

[M0YDH]

All very nice but we have no receivers to buy. Gareth is right. A NIM is needed so DATV can continue to grow.

In the unrealistic hopes department is a wish that SATSAGEN gets into Portsdown test setup.

73
David M0YDH

[SkyVision]

Thoughts from VK

What's the chances of having a DATV easy/Freestream coder style of things, doing software encoding, if there is enough grunt for that
So it can run easily with OBS/Vmix

Input and/or output from SRT (which is pretty bullet proof) NB. Nvidia just signed up to the SRT alliance, open source and it just works

QO100 seems to be a major focus for you guys, but has no relavence for VK or US (spare a thought for us in the shadow)

Some sort of TSoIP or ASI interface, so it brings cheap ex broadcast hardware modulation in to the Amateur relm

Power requirement for portable just went up

All very well looking forward, we need an entry level mode to get newbies involved (that is super cheap and easy) preset parameters maybe

Pcie could bring something to the table, the new M.2 Lime outboarded, or Pcie RX cards with useful Nims TBS etc, Nvidia M.2 GPU (just dreaming)

Sorry, I'm rambling again Roger VK5YYY

[DL5BCA]

Hello,
of course, a touchscreen system makes a lot of sense. This eliminates the need for switches, potentiometers and a mouse.

What previous speakers have written is our biggest problem is the procurement of NIMs that can handle small bandwidths. Or it has to be decoded using software (e.g. SDRAngle).

Regarding the power consumption of the PI5: I saw a test on YouTube yesterday that compared the power consumption between PI4 and PI5. The PI5 even achieved lower power consumption.